51 Responses to “Presto, Change-o, DARVO: Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender”

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  1. Mellaril

    Another great article! Have you ever thought of setting up a lecture series that you could give at places like Law Enforcement Conferences, etc.? You could call it something “Sorting through High Conflict Domestic Situations, Making Sure the Real Abuser is Identified.” Give a similar kind of presentation to divorce attorneys and trial lawyers. You could make a buck and target a specific audience who are positions to directly affect peoples’ lives. I think you could do really well in this area and the timing seems pretty good.

    This is the kind of material that belongs in places like law schools and criminal justice curricula.

    • Closure at last

      I second that, Mellaril. Another terrific analysis Dr. T!

      And not just in law schools, but taught also to men in high schools and universities too and all other professions where there are more men (armed forces, engineering etc.) since these men do not come across a large cross-section of women they are often naive about not knowing that not all girls are the same, and lack the tools of deciphering the bad apples from the good. (to develop an x-ray vision to see the poisonous-worm in the apple BEFORE he takes a bite.)

      Can you believe how much time, love, patience, energy, money and mental peace could have been conserved if these facts and knowledge had been made available before in our society?? (Perhaps that’s why the mainstream institutes never talk openly of this. I often say that the whole world is self-immolating in an orgy of ‘political correctness’. It seems easier to lynch truth-tellers than bring justice to cunning manipulators.)

      Thanks, doc, for another great piece.

    • Dr Tara J. Palmatier

      Hi Mellaril,

      Thanks, I appreciate the positive feedback. I’ve never considered doing a lecture series. It’s a good suggestion. However, it might put the horse before the cart. I think I would need a book first and some guidance as I’ve no idea how to assemble something like that.

      • JPJ

        If you do ever write a book,it will be a reference book for sure.This is a groundbreaking gathering of information on a subject that has,up to now been totally swept under the carpet.
        I have had to re-read this piece several times to totally get it.
        Thank you so much.

      • Autumn

        I think a book is a fantastic idea Dr. Palmatier! I have been on Amazon looking for something, ANYTHING on this, and its always about women. Not that that’s a bad thing, but where is the awareness about abuse against men?

        This is one of the only places I’ve found that acknowledges it and doesn’t turn around and encourage the man to stay with the abusive wife, change his behavior to adapt to her needs (more catering to the pathology!), and continue to be a slave and better learn to live with the misery. They even admit that things will only get nominally better, if at all.

  2. ron7127

    This technique is, frequently , employed by cheating spouses who are busted. It is fairly common and the attacking and projecting are sure signs you got it right.
    I have noticed how adept these folks are at playing to their audience, too. They are very convincing and try to provoke the abused through making the abused look bad to others.
    The best way to handle them is to simply refuse to engage in any form of debate or argument with them. Just walk away.

    • Dr Tara J. Palmatier

      As with everything else with these types, the more disproportionate their reactions, the more likely you’re hitting too close to home or have hit the bullseye.

  3. jonsid

    Absolutely bog-standard behaviour that I got to recognise so well. I do however think it should be emphasised that the denial part of the acronym is NOT the denial we hear so much of in psychology forums, usually referring to defence mechanisms. That denial is classically a refusal to accept something that is too painful or upsetting for us to cope with. The denial in this case is denial as in bare faced, conscious lying, deceit and manipulation. I suppose you could say it is, if anything, an offensive mechanism

  4. david

    “…high-conflict individuals who engage in this behavior often can’t substantiate their claims or, if they just make up more lies to try to substantiate their claims, they’re inconsistent over time, so pay close attention and document their lies”.

    Invaluable insight. I’ve been doing this for the last several months. Every lie, every distortion and possible “spin routine” she could throw at me. It also keeps you grounded and a “shield” from future gaslighting or hoovers. Great stuff (as all the articles here are).

    [Mellaril] A friend and I were talking of this just the other day. All law enforcement officers should be required to be educated about Cluster B types and their behaviors. It would save everyone time and heartache in the long term.

    [ron7127] How true. When they spend every waking moment doing something, you get very good at it. But when you understand the behavior and their ways….they’re just “one trick ponies”. And in so many ways, they’re all the same…like a blueprint. I can spot a NPD or BPD in a matter of minutes now, it seems.

  5. exscapegoat

    Excellent work in describing the blame shifting. Even when they’re responsible for doing something to someone else, they’ll try and blame the person who was hurt and/or wronged. When I was 2 years old, perhaps getting close to 3 (as I do have some memory of the event), my mother accidentally burned me on my hand with a cigarette while she was trying to get me out of a snowsuit. It was truly an accident, not intentional on her part. She was a very young & inexperienced mother and it was the 60s and people chain smoked while caring for their kids. So I don’t think it’s fair to judge by today’s parenting standards. Basically, what I remember is some pain, cold water and a very nervous mother telling me not to cry.

    I think she felt guilty about it and was scared that people would judge her. The scar eventually faded to where you can hardly see it, but for awhile it was quite noticeable and people would ask about it. When I was 4 or 5, so many people had asked about it, I mentioned it to someone once without being asked about it.

    Here’s how all of this was spun in family lore:

    1) I was squirming and that why I got burned. Yes, apparently 2-3 year olds are supposed to know not to squirm around and there’s no responsibility on the part of parents to keep toddlers and the parents’ own cigarettes away from each other (we need an eye rolly smiley).

    2) I embarrassed/humiliated her by telling people about the scar from the burn. Yes, because apparently at 4-5, I wasn’t just commenting on it because other people were, I was commenting on it because I wanted to humiliate and embarrass her parenting skills (again eye rolly smiley).

    At some point when I was between 5-8 (don’t remember the exact age), my dad did another of those “that’s what they did back in the 60s” parenting moves and threatened to burn my hand if I didn’t get over my fear of turning on the stove. While I was very frightened by that, I don’t know that he really intended to follow through. We weren’t supposed to talk about the actual burn on my hand, but this was fair game and she’d bring it up periodically. I’m guessing it may have been an attempt to deflect onto him? Despite that and some other issues, he spent a lot more time with us than most men at the time did with their kid and did enough household tasks to where people would comment on it being unusual for the time.

    Another time, she tried to subtly blame my younger brother when she got drunk because apparently junior high schoolers are supposed to know the proper ratio of scotch & soda vs. wine spritzers. The words were along the lines of “it’s not really his fault, but he mixed them wrong because he was used to the wine spritzers”. Even though it attracted some of her wrath, I stood up to her on that one. I told her he was just a kid and shouldn’t be expected to know how to mix drinks.

    Damn junior high kids, getting their parents drunk, that’s always a troublesome developmental phase! You think they’d learn better in home ec about proper alcohol to mixer rations for different drinks! :) The smileys may seem inappropriate, but as one Mr. Buffett said, “If we couldnt laugh we just would go insane”. Much like the translations, I find applying reality to the things they say/do in a humorous way to be helpful. It helps stop the target from buying into the mindbleepery and laughing seems to help with the tension. Though not around them, I wouldn’t recommend that! :)

  6. jonnevi

    I see this all the time in my Ex through out our relationship and especially thru the divorce. It really is sad that it is so pervalent that there is a term of it.
    I really am confused how people learn to behave this way. My ex was so good at spinning a story so fast and moving on to something else and turning it around on me. And before I can even reply she starts to bombard we with accusations so fast that I cannot catchup to talk about each of the accusations.. Then you cannot even remember what the arguement was all about, your head is just spinning and all you want to do is get away.

    Jon

    • B Experienced

      They do it because they are fragile narcissists. They can’t deal with pain competently so they deflect blame on to others to ward off further loss of self esteem and pain in themselves. The more accusations she throws at you the less loss of self esteem and pain she feels.

  7. SweetJones

    My ex was quite proud of her ability to DARVO, and even had her own name for it. She called it “the twist” and explicitly claimed to be its master. Of course as the years went on, she even started projecting that technique, claiming that I and not her was the true master-twister, alongside my “raging narcissism,” and mad manipulation skills. (If so, I was like that kid in that anti-drug ad: “But I learned it from you, crazy ex!”) I also regularly heard conversion out of her; in the rare cases that she would accept some blame for one of our fights, she would often say “I’ll make a change,” but over time the smirk got a little bigger every time she would say that. She had no intention of changing because she refused to believe she needed to. She would only accept blame as a way of calling a cease-fire, a lull between combats. Cats toying with mice often appear bored for a minute or two at a time before they resume their tortures, the Western Front in World War I was not non-stop attacks and counter-attacks. There were respites, and her little non-apologies were very much in the same vein. There was no intention to ever resolve anything, only truces to gather strength and marshal strategems.

    • B Experienced

      It is all psychopathic. She thrives on the adversity for stimulation and to feel alive. When her opponents starts to get sick of it she lets the rope slack a bit to give them some room to breath. She then lets it go well for a while to give people some time to believe her false promise. Then she yanks the chain again. It is sadistic.

  8. ron7127

    I am gld you mentioned the ad hominem technique, as it is one with which I have been dealing, lately.
    I have been hearing from a disordered family member, lately, regarding a number of issues. But, here is an example of how she goes about it.
    Recently, my deceased mther’s house was put on the market and a certain amount of work had to be done on it to ready it for sale. I live very far away, so the bulk of the work was done by my siblings. It was not all that arduous, IMO, as most of it involved getting contractor’s to do work on the house. But, one sibling, in particular, seemed to think it was very taxin(note, she is not used to working very hard and goes through a lot of jobs).
    In any case, I did drive 1200 miles to help with some moving. I got a letter, upon my return, criticizing the amount of my contribution( I am pushing 60, work a sedentary job and heavy lifting is tough for me).
    I had no real problem with this criticism, as I dismissed it, considering the sourdce and her perception of what constituted a lot of work. But, in the course of this critcism, she interjected a number of other attacks on me: my taking a much needed vacation(none of her business); pretending to have consulted with another sister re an agreement I reached to repay a looan(my older sister kept insisting that I refrain from paying the entire amount ,while I kept telling her doing so was no problem). She also informed me that her boyfriend felt I was interferring with his ability to have a conversation with my other brother because I was conversing with the boyfriend too much.
    I checked with my older sister, the one who loaned me some money and she was shocked at how this sister both interferred and misrepresented things.
    Anyway, I can rcognize these tactic right away, now, after all this reading. These folks are very adept at trying to turn simple discussions about differences in opinion into personal attacks. Just walk away.

    • B Experienced

      She is bored and feeling unloved and left out. She picks fights for stimulation and because she is jealous of your relationship with your sister who loaned you money. The Cluster B’s are full of jealousy and anger. She is looking to blame someone for her problem with your brother. Her narcissism good give a hoot about your health problems, age, or that you went over the top and drove 12,000 miles! She is and will always be a bottomless pit of need because of her abnormal boundaries and immaturity.

      The Cluster B’s National Anthem in their Land of Distortion is Me, Me, Me.

      • ron7127

        It is amazing to watch her work. In no time at all, she can offend another. My older sister was telling us about some advice my mom had given her re one of her old boyfriends, advising her that he was not very nice and she should stay away. Out of the blue, the disordered sister smirks and flippantlly says “I never heard her say that.”, trying to imply my older sister was making it up.
        Well, duh. I wonder if the sneering sister ever considered the fact that our mom had seperate relationships with each of us and might mot have consulted with her before advising my other sister.
        This is but one example.

  9. ron7127

    Actaully, the phenomena I described above is not really an ad hominem deal, but, rather , just a string of false statements designed to hurt.

  10. Verbal

    DARVO is somewhat similar to something my dad once observed in my Cluster B wife, which he called simply “The Technique.” The way it works is:

    “She badgers a person until they sue for peace, and then she extracts a concession.”

    My dad compared her technique to how the old Soviet Union would approach deals with the West. Eventually, we wind up conceding that there is partial truth to their accusations (even if we don’t believe it is so) in the hope that it will end the attack. Thus, we begin our slide down the slippery slope of caving in to their abuse.

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